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Shockey Gold American Powder?


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#1 Rowdy Yates

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Posted 11 August 2008 - 10:10 AM

What's your honest opinion of this black powder substitute?

I'm totally new to this so I thought I'd start off looking at some thing a well known and heavily advertised combination of loads, this with the Nozler 250 grain sabots. I'll be shooting a T/C encore Endeavor.
"Keep the sun forever at your back, the wind forever in your face, and may forever God bless you out there on the trail."

#2 7pointbuck

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Posted 11 August 2008 - 01:26 PM

mark i have shot it for several hunts, i love it,i shoot a 45 cal shooting 195 gr powerbelts killed several deer with this combination.the powder is cleaner burning than the pyrodex,it burns consistant and i have never had a failure with it.......the residue cleans up easily from the bore.


dang mark, it feels good finally getting to share a tip with you,instead of the other way around :clap: lol :boone:





What's your honest opinion of this black powder substitute?

I'm totally new to this so I thought I'd start off looking at some thing a well known and heavily advertised combination of loads, this with the Nozler 250 grain sabots. I'll be shooting a T/C encore Endeavor.


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#3 Rowdy Yates

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Posted 11 August 2008 - 02:28 PM

Thanks Bill,

Ya I'm needing all the advice I can muster from you, and the gang on Mussy stuffer. Ohio extended their ML season a few more days this years so I here go extending my season.

Edited by Rowdy Yates, 11 August 2008 - 02:30 PM.

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#4 Chrud

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Posted 11 August 2008 - 05:03 PM

It is OK. It definately cleans up as advertised. However, I didn't like how the corners broke off when putting the pellets down the muzzle. I switched to Pyrodex pellets.

#5 PA RIDGE RUNNER

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Posted 11 August 2008 - 07:40 PM

Rowdy I have not tried the APP Gold but did try the regular APP. None of my rifles use the 209 shotgun primers for ignition. I had delayed ignition about half the time and at least one failure to ignite with the #11 percussion caps. My experience also with the regular APP powder was it was weaker than any of the other powders I have tried. I had no chronograph but percieved recoil and bullet impact indicated it to be weaker than even real black powder. This was born out by a chart published by Hornady indicating that of the 4 powders tested by them APP was weakest. I do understand that using a 209 primer eliminates the delayed ignition problem.
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#6 Rowdy Yates

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Posted 12 August 2008 - 08:22 AM

Thanks Chrud and PA Ridge Runner for your opinion. Like I said I started with a muzzle loader TV program advertisement. I hope to get out this weekend to try shooting it for the first time. I want to get off on the right foot with a good load in the barrel. :D
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#7 Chrud

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Posted 12 August 2008 - 07:53 PM

For what it's worth, Pyrodex pellets are no more difficult to clean that "APPJSG." I do have my own routine after each shot. Like the DVD suggested, I clean between shots. I use one wet patch and two dry patches between each shot. I swab with the wet patch, flip it, and then swab again. Then, I swab with the first dry patch, then the second (by this time the patch is clean as a whistle) and finally flip the second patch just to get any moisture out of the barrel.

There is a small dirt ring (I figure someone will call it a "Chrud" ring yet :D ) that builds up in front of the breech plug, but a wire breech brush takes care of that in 30 seconds.

#8 PA RIDGE RUNNER

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Posted 12 August 2008 - 07:56 PM

Rowdy I will admit I am a little biased. A hangfire with APP and a kantankerous sidelock percussion caused me to miss the biggest buck I ever shot at in Kansas. It was about a 170s buck. Needless to say I was a bit predjudiced against the APP and Traditions rifles. When I got back home I bought a Knight Bighorn inline and have never looked back. That knight is as accurate as my modern rifles. The bighorn is a striker fired action and is set up for either the #11 cap or by changing the nipple I can use musket caps. I could convert the rifle to fire the 209 primers but I get such good accuracy with less than 100 gr of real black powder that I do not have an urge to switch.
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#9 cayugad

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Posted 12 August 2008 - 08:01 PM

A T/C Encore/Endeavor is a great rifle. The same kind that Jim Shockey shoots from what I was told. As for his powder... I have never shot the Shockey brand but have shot a LOT of American Pioneer Powder. Shockey is APP with a little more screening is all. All I will say is, it will probably shoot in your rifle. I personally did not find the consistency in the APP brands of powder, I demand. What I mean is, one time it shot excellent and then the next time out, not so good. Also APP is prone to moisture problems.

If I had your rifle, and wanted to shoot long range and accurate, I would get my hands on some BlackHorn 209 powder. This is an expensive powder, but IMO one of the best on the market for the better grade rifles like you own. I would then get some 250 grain Nosler Partition , 250 grain Parker Extreme, or some 250 grain Shockwaves. With a good scope, that is a 200 yard rifle with that powder.

There is nothing those rifles could not shoot. Most of the people are shooting 110-120 grains of BlackHorn and getting under 4" groups at 200 yards. Also the powder is very powerful, there is no swabbing required, it is non corrosive, and does not seize breech plugs. I have tested a couple pounds of it now, and it is one powder that impresses the devil out of me. It almost makes me want to go out and purchase a new Triumph.
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#10 Rowdy Yates

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Posted 13 August 2008 - 07:10 AM

A T/C Encore/Endeavor is a great rifle. The same kind that Jim Shockey shoots from what I was told. As for his powder... I have never shot the Shockey brand but have shot a LOT of American Pioneer Powder. Shockey is APP with a little more screening is all. All I will say is, it will probably shoot in your rifle. I personally did not find the consistency in the APP brands of powder, I demand. What I mean is, one time it shot excellent and then the next time out, not so good. Also APP is prone to moisture problems.

If I had your rifle, and wanted to shoot long range and accurate, I would get my hands on some BlackHorn 209 powder. This is an expensive powder, but IMO one of the best on the market for the better grade rifles like you own. I would then get some 250 grain Nosler Partition , 250 grain Parker Extreme, or some 250 grain Shockwaves. With a good scope, that is a 200 yard rifle with that powder.

There is nothing those rifles could not shoot. Most of the people are shooting 110-120 grains of BlackHorn and getting under 4" groups at 200 yards. Also the powder is very powerful, there is no swabbing required, it is non corrosive, and does not seize breech plugs. I have tested a couple pounds of it now, and it is one powder that impresses the devil out of me. It almost makes me want to go out and purchase a new Triumph.


Great advice thanks Cayugad! I put some of the Blackhorn 209 on order at Cabelas yesterday but it's on B.O. so I'll wait for it and look around town for some. Thanks.
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#11 sticknstring

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Posted 13 August 2008 - 01:21 PM

I shot the regular APP and didn't like it-for all the same reasons the other guys mentioned here. I currently shoot 100 grains of triple 7 along with 250 grain shockwaves. My encore is a 200 yard gun. It is sighted 3" high at 100, dead on @ 200 yrds "where the thick and thin" part of the bottom vertical crosshair (duplex style crosshairs) meets. You got a heck of a rifle-have fun with it! ...also-be patient and work it up gradually.

#12 Falcon

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Posted 14 November 2008 - 11:46 AM

Forget about the APP and JSG sticks, they are very inconsistent. Started using APP when it was Clean Shot. Then got away from it. Couple of years ago i started using JSG. JSG is a very good powder but is not as strong as Pyrodex.

JSG likes a tight fitting sabot that is tamped very solidly on the powder. Some of my best groups have been fired with 90-110 grains of JSG and the 250 grain SST/Shockwave. Killed a hog at a transit lasered 192 yards with that bullet and 90 grains of JSG.

This year i started using 2F and 3F Goex Pinnacle powder. It has a lot more power then either JSG or APP: 2F Pinnacle is nearly the equal of 2F Pyrodex in power. Pinnacle also likes a tight fitting sabot that is seated hard. Seat the sabot until you can feel the charge compress.

The nice thing about JSG and Pinnacle is the ease of cleanup. There is no crud ring like you have with 777. After firing 20-30 rounds the breech plug comes out very easily: That does not happen with Pyrodex and 777.

Last week i killed a small buck at a transit lasered 136 yards using my CVA Stag Horn loaded with 110 grains of 2F Pinnacle and a 240 grain .430 XTP bullet in a Knight sabot.




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