Jump to content


Photo

Wolfs


  • Please log in to reply
7 replies to this topic

#1 timothy

timothy

    Always Here

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 144 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Roy, UT
  • Interests:Hunting, Fishing, Xbox, My Wife and awsome son James, Guns, Mountains, Hounds, any thing outdoors.

Posted 28 April 2010 - 07:05 PM

I live in Utah and luckily this part of the rockys has not been affected as much by the increased wolf numbers as some of the other states. My father in law has been a houndsman most of his life and has recently gotten me into it. I have never been a fan of wolfs due to their hunger for killing but not eating. a few days ago while looking through some hound forums i found a post about a guy whos dog had been ripped apart by 3 or 4 wolfs while treeing on a lion. he managed to save her as far as i read, but not w/o a 6000 dollar vet bill and some terrible scarring to the dog. I started wondering if this was somthing out of the norm and for that area it was totally normal, in fact houndsman were either posting they were done hunting the area, or gearing up to go poach as many of the *******s as they could find. so i started digging more, i alreay knew of the massivly decreasing elk herds in idaho, but worse was the accounts of people jogging in citys and having wolfs sneak up out of the brush and terrorize them. With the recent death of a school teacher in alaska, i know i will be prepared everytime i step into the hills. I applaud senator christenson of Utah for his new wolf program putting wolves in northern Utah in the crosshairs. If your interested i found two really good sites about wolves with both pro's and the con's.

http://graywolfnews.com/
http://washingtonwolf.info/

Im interested in what your take is on wolves, I think from a conservation standpoint most will agree they are more of a negative than a positive influence on the ecosystem.





#2 Micky

Micky

    Always Here

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 130 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:San Angelo, Texas

Posted 28 April 2010 - 09:42 PM

We don't have any wolves out here. But, I sure am not a fan of them. I know what predators can do to other wildlife and livestock, if their numbers are not kept in check. Make it open season on wolves year 'round as far as I am concerned. Posted Image

Edited by Micky, 28 April 2010 - 09:42 PM.


#3 Phil

Phil

    Never Logs Off

  • Authors
  • 2,379 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 29 April 2010 - 04:37 AM

Reading articles from hunters in areas with large wolf populations sure gives us eastern hunters a better understanding of the havoc being reaked by those predators than the "Thumper/Bambi" articles published by the squirrel kissing media.Posted Image


Posted Image

#4 Whip

Whip

    Always Here

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 412 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Nebraska
  • Interests:Long walks in the woods carrying heavy equpment in poor weather. I live to hunt...other than that I am a full-time PhD student in entomology.

Posted 29 April 2010 - 10:33 AM

I think humans are more of a negative than positive influence on the ecosystem, but just like the wolves, we have our place. As a wildlife biologist, I hear the wolf argument everyday. Wolves do a lot of good, but the problem occurs from people and wolves interacting, not wolves interacting with other organisms. They do a great deal of damage to the livestock industry and occassionally (although not often) humans themselves. I see both sides, and wolves definitely have their place. I do agree that they should be kept in check in many areas. Hound hunting always has its' dangers....I have hunted and taken lions with hounds. On one occassion four dogs were killed by the lion before there was even a chance to shoot it. He's lucky the dog is alive...one dog is no match for a wolf or a lion. I would suggest a pack lol. I would be more than happy to discuss this issue further with any of you, but it might require a phone convo.....wolf talks typically get long winded. :) Take care fellas.
Sean Whipple
PSE staff
It's not a passion, it's an obsession. ~Mossy Oak

#5 timothy

timothy

    Always Here

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 144 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Roy, UT
  • Interests:Hunting, Fishing, Xbox, My Wife and awsome son James, Guns, Mountains, Hounds, any thing outdoors.

Posted 29 April 2010 - 03:59 PM

well its good to see that their are pro wolf people in the community, i would definatly be more inclined to listen to that than some nut rambling on about respecting mother nature and letting it run its own course. I think your right (especially since your more experienced in the subject than i am) they do serve a purpose, but i think we would be ignorant not to moniter them closely and keep their numbers and a minimal level for their survival. With all the other predators, and eager hunters their isnt much need to throw a predator like the wolf a HUGE role in balancing the eco system.

#6 RobertR

RobertR

    Hunting Resource

  • Moderators
  • 312 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 29 April 2010 - 08:05 PM

Whip I know you and I have discussed the wolf issue before but unless one can be out west and see what is happening at ground level and the impact the wolf is having on wildlife populations, livestock and the stress that has been put upon people in general, the biological facts are skewed.

I think I can speak for most sports men and women that we do not want to eliminate any one species just control it so that we have a future in hunting and the outdoors as we seem to be the only managers of wildlife and our dollars go towards protecting and preserving there habitat and the animals.
I have long said that this has been an anti strategy and we will pay in the end by having are rights taken away from us.
What I am about to say might offend some but it's my opinion because of what I have seen first hand.

I'm convinced, based on several years of wolf research, that hunters will bear the brunt of wolf recovery/protection regardless of location.
There is no language written in any wolf recovery plan to protect the hunter's privilege to hunt. Wolves are well known to cause wild game population declines which are so drastic hunting is either eliminated or severely curtailed. And there is no provision for recovery of wild game populations for the purposes of hunting. It simply will not be allowed.
The problem with wolf recovery is that most people, especially hunters, have not looked "beyond press releases and into the heart of the wolf issue."
It must be stated clearly that the wolf is the best tool for shutting down hunting. The anti-hunters know this. Most hunters don't. Thus, wolf recovery is not opposed by the people who will be impacted most.
A wolf requires five to ten pounds of meat per day for survival, thus the wolf requires a considerable amount of meat in one year - nearly a ton of meat per year per wolf. A wolf is capable of consuming great quantities of meat, up to one fifth of its body weight, at one time. Thus, a wolf does not have to kill each day to survive.
Wolves hunt year around - 365 days a year. That means predation is not limited to two weeks, one month or whatever a hunting season length may be, it is year around.
Wolves are opportunistic hunters, meaning they kill what is available and convenient. For years, hunters have been fed the line, "Wolves kill only the weak, sick and old." Worse yet, hunters have believed it.
It is true, wolves do kill old animals, but so do hunters. Those are the big bulls or bucks prized by many who hunt. In fact, biological studies have shown wolves kill older male animals more than any other adult member of a wild game population.
Trapping completes the cycle of game management by controlling the predator. The predator is to wildlife what weeds are to a garden. They must be controlled or they will take over. Additionally, predators are disease carriers. Some people are aware that predators carry rabies since reports of rabid animals or some person being bitten by a rabid animal are often in the news, but few realize that predators also carry deadly diseases to other wild animals, i.e. raccoons carry a deadly fowl cholera. And finally, trapping benefits the predator by keeping their numbers in check. This keeps the population healthy. If predators do overpopulate, they become more susceptible to rabies, mange and other diseases.
We are loosing are cow to calf ratio in the elk because they do not breed up the same because of the wolf and during there mating season they are less vocal because of the wolf.
If you are hunting mountain lions with hounds and you cross wolf tracks you better get your dogs out of the area or you will loose some of your hounds that's a proven fact, because a baying hound is a dinner bell because the wolf is protecting it's territory.
I probably could say more but it only upsets me that it took this long to start managing the wolf through hunting seasons but I'll leave it alone.

Posted Image
I'M NOT AFRAID OF COMMITMENT I'VE BEEN HUNTING AND FISHING MY WHOLE LIFE!
Montana Hunting Discovering Montana

#7 timothy

timothy

    Always Here

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 144 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Roy, UT
  • Interests:Hunting, Fishing, Xbox, My Wife and awsome son James, Guns, Mountains, Hounds, any thing outdoors.

Posted 29 April 2010 - 09:44 PM

robert im glad you brought up the point about diseases i had forgotten about that point. as well as the amount of food a single wolf will consume in one year. graywolfnews.com says that a single wolf will eat 17 elk or 44 deer in a year, there are over 1000 wolves in idaho, thats 17000 elk, or 44000 deer, now you can subtract the livestock, domestic animals and other various creatures a wolf may find to eat, but even at half that number a states herd of elk and deer cannot be sustained. the worst part is thats not how many are consumed thats just killed. They dont eat a entire animal sometimes they just kill them for the thrill. like i said i know there is a place for them, really that place is a zoo.

#8 Whip

Whip

    Always Here

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 412 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Nebraska
  • Interests:Long walks in the woods carrying heavy equpment in poor weather. I live to hunt...other than that I am a full-time PhD student in entomology.

Posted 02 May 2010 - 10:36 PM

I agree with much of what you said Robert. I am certainly not against hunters or ranchers (because I am both), nor am I against wolves...they just need to be managed. I have said before I own a ranch, and have seen at ground level the damage they do. I have also seen it from a supercub airplane using a benelli shotgun and some #4 buckshot :). I know how the government deals with wolves, and I know the policies that are written to both protect and manage them....It was my job. I have a feeling the problem will get better over time. Again, more than happy to discuss it with anyone, but my typing skills are much worse than my knowledge of wildlife biology...lol. Feel free to give me a call. Take care guys.
Sean Whipple
PSE staff
It's not a passion, it's an obsession. ~Mossy Oak




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users